Shaping Forehands

[jasonfrausto]

When I gauge the time is right or sometimes it simply works its way round on its own.

Missed the blogspeed thingy...what was that?

Agreed, each kid has their own timeline based on how things are progressing. Eastern has been the best starting point for the majority of my students. I don't want them going full western "accidentally".

[stotty]

What kind of side trajectory do you expect from Sany?
A drawing could help,if possible

The blogspeed link is broken.

I don't go too much into the science of things with young kids, so coaching trajectory is not for me. I go for an overall basic shape when coaching forehands and ask kids to copy good examples. It's hopeless talking science to 7 and 8 year-olds...or most adults come to that.

I have a pragmatic approach to coaching.

[julian1]

Trajectory

What kind of side trajectory do you expect from Sany?
A drawing could help,if possible

[julian1]

Comparing forehands of Murray and Federer

When I gauge the time is right or sometimes it simply works its way round on its own.

Missed the blogspeed thingy...what was that?

It was
comparison of forehands of Murray and Federer

http://blog.tennisspeed.com/2012/01/...nd-part-4.html

I think they played the match lately,but I am NOT sure

[stotty]

Semi-western

The only question remains when to move to semi-western?
Did you get my link about Murray at blog.tennisspeed.com?

When I gauge the time is right or sometimes it simply works its way round on its own.

Missed the blogspeed thingy...what was that?

[julian1]

When to move to semi-western?

I always start young kids off with an Eastern. If they start off with semi-western, then there is a risk over time they will move to a full-western. Full western doesn't work for most players in my view. And it's murder to get kids to move their grip back to semi-western once it has slipped around unnoticed...coaches nightmare in fact.

The only question remains when to move to semi-western?
Did you get my link about Murray at blog.tennisspeed.com?

[stotty]

Grips

Could you elaborate,please? Eastern forehand for forehand?
Your quote
"I encourage a conservative grip with the very young"

I always start young kids off with an Eastern. If they start off with semi-western, then there is a risk over time they will move to a full-western. Full western doesn't work for most players in my view. And it's murder to get kids to move their grip back to semi-western once it has slipped around unnoticed...coaches nightmare in fact.

[julian1]

Could you elaborate,please?

Could you elaborate,please? Eastern forehand for forehand?
Your quote
"I encourage a conservative grip with the very young"

[tennis_chiro]

Lots of work and lots of fun!

My first thought is you have a lot of work ahead of you the next few years, but a lot of fun too! I think all except Misha (as you point out) have the beginnings of real good forehands. Misha is trying a little too hard to run the ball to the other side of the net. Even there are the beginnings of a good little player.

But it seems to me that they are all moving a little too much as they hit the ball. I know they are trying to hit a sharp, aggressive forehand, but they seem to be trying to jump into the shot. I'd like to see a little more of a rotation and turn around a firmly planted front or even just slightly anterior off foot (left for righties) or in an open stance a clear rotation about an imaginary stake through the left hip or even the right hip if the ball is caught very late; but there has to be a point about which the body rotates. Only later would I have them let the momentum of the swing take the right side of the body (for righties) up into the air and into the court. But I would not have the whole body moving forward. Am I too stuck in the old world??

Also love Sany's aggression when the ball comes, but I would want to try to introduce somewhat more economical footwork to her; somewhat more "Federian". I know you are a great admirer of Federer's movement; Sany's footwork is more like the Spanish model with all the side steps; obviously, it works great, but I prefer the economy of Federer.

As you pointed out, Owen and Misha's backswings are a little too far behind them,but I would be more worried about Owen's swing as he ends up with a later more circular forward swing. Misha looks like he straightens it out and gets inside/out on the ball pretty well. Owen, on the other hand, appears to me to be pulling the ball a little bit more.

But they definitely are taking great cuts at the ball and by and large holding it on the strings pretty well; for their age, I think it's terrific and very promising.

don

[johnyandell]

Sany is a natural born killer.

[stotty]

The forehand is my favourite shot in tennis. For me, it's the backbone of a player's game. The shot fascinates me. I work very hard to develop good forehands in my students if I can. I like forehands to be simple to produce and reliable. A weak forehand equals a player who will always struggle to win tough matches.

Where possible I try install good forehands in kids from the outset:

Here are four of my youngest players in the order they appear on the clip: Louis, aged 7, Owen (8), Vinay (7) Misha (8). All have ability and are as keen as mustard.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6qvbCngyPhA&feature=youtu.be

I like to get youngsters to achieve key technical things:

*Establish a good grip (I encourage a conservative grip with the very young)
*Develop the unit turn
*The non-hitting arm stretch across the body
*The tip of the racket pointing upwards when commencing the backswing (I am very fond of this type of start to the backswing)
*Develop a good base with the feet.
*Keep the backswing on the hitting side of the body

I am gradually ticking all the boxes with the four boys. The last item on that list is trickiest to maintain. All kids want to whack the ball and the type 1 forehand surfaces very quickly…it's kind of obvious it will happen, isn't it?. As you can see from the clip, Louis and Owen extend their backswings a little too far…but I am working to tame their exuberance. Misha lacks shape yet while Vinay cannot mentally separate when to use an open stance and a neutral stance.

The next clip shows the girl from the infamous "backswings" thread posted around a year ago. She recently turned 10 years old. The original backswings thread had to be deleted from the forum because of abusive remarks from one individual. It was a shame because it was one of the best threads I ever started on Tennisplayer. The contributions from other coaches were immense. Tennisplayer has an array of experienced coaches on the forum who form a powerful coaching team when united together.

The thread (with video clips) centred around a girl with an excessive backswing. I was concerned about her backswing because it ventured way beyond the hitting side of her body. Though many women on the tour have excessive backswings, I was uncomfortable with it in her case. Her forehand was both powerless and erratic.

Many coaches contributed to the thread with recommendations for how to improve her forehand. Brian Gordon chipped in with advice, stating the forehand backswing was part of a body of work he was embarked on. I now guess that must have been his latest work on the ATP forehand.

I am posting two clips:

Clip 1: Shows where the girl's forehand was last year. It shows her excessive backswing, It also reveals a full semi western grip and a dubious start to the backswing; with the head of the racket lagging.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lwne-vvrErI&feature=youtu.be

Clip 2: Shows the latest in the girl's development on the forehand side… with most of the boxes ticked…still work to do but we're getting there. Don't you just love the way she is itching to move and work?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZFxeaD_V4vc&feature=youtu.be

I wonder how other coaches develop forehands in their young players? I wonder what boxes you like to tick when developing forehands in young children? Feel free to comment on the kids in the clip but have in mind the children are very young and I can only achieve so much at this stage.